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 Pregnant Platty

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PostSubject: Pregnant Platty   Sat Apr 18, 2009 8:24 am

we're new to having fish and started off 2 weeks ago with 14 fish


3 Clown loaches
2 Pleck
5 Cardinal Tetra
4 Platty

we now only have 4 platty's!!!! one of which is pregnant. one of the males is constantly by her nursery net and is chasing the other males away from her and he appears to have like a white shimmer on him at the moment and we are wondering if he could possibly be the "daddy" so to speak and is looking after her? and are wondering if the white shimmer he appears to have is due to stress?

any help/advice would be greatly appreciated.

thanks
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PostSubject: Re: Pregnant Platty   Sat Apr 18, 2009 8:47 am

white shimmer? you mean it looks kinda like a fluff or is it more like spots?

If its like fluff - then its likely a fungal infection f some sort - if its like spots (grains of salt or sugar sized zits) then its more than likely ich - if its a golden colour then its velvet - either of the two are treated in much the same way.

If its fungal - pimafix will work well - its a natural product and isnt harsh to the fish or the filter (as meds go) if its either ich or velvet - you need an anti parasite medication from the fish shop

A good clear picture would help us alot - but if its ich, the sooner you can start treatment the better.

The other thing is that you have been fooled into making the single most common mistake in fishkeeping - ie that you can keep xyz so soon after starting the tank - what has happened (and I dont wish to make you feel bad but the following is the truth and their is no easy way to say it) is that all but the toughest fish have literally been poisoned by their own body wastes.

To cut a complicated process down to simple lines, is that your fish tank is an ecosystem, at the root of this sytem are bacteria - these use the fish wate as food, turning it from ammonia to noitrite - both of these are deadly to fish (and most creatures) so a next batch of bugs uses the nitrite as food and leave nitrate as the end product, this is tolerable to most fish (upto a point) and is the chemical removed when you do a water change.

OK, first of all, you need to NOT buy any more fish for possibly a month now.

What you do need is to buy a basic water testing kit which has an Ammonia, Nitrite and Nitrate test kit, api do the best pack (for about 20) which also includes a pH kit (not important at this point).

What you really really need to do to save the remaining fish 9and whislt this is going to sound very nasty) for the benefit of the adult fish in your tank, you could do without any platty fry - I suspect the bad water will kill them off, so be sure to remove any dead plattys asap.

You need to be changing water twice a day right now - I suggest doing 50% water changes every 12 hours for about a week - then probably the same ever day for a week after the first week.

If you dont know what I/We mean by a water change, you remove whatever quantity of water from the tank (and use it on the garden and houseplants or down the drain) and replace it with fresh water from the tap - but put the tap water into buckets first and use a chemical called a dechlorinator to make it safe for fish (it removes the chlorine and other nasties in the tap water) - more importantly - this stops the chlorine in the tap water killing the bacteria in your tank and filter that you need to keep everything healthy.

By changing the water this way, you make conditions more tolerable for the remaining fish and also allow time for the bacteria that support your tank to grow and multiply in the filter - this is known as cycling your tank (the nitrogen cycle).

You will also need to treat the fish for whatever disease they have, remember to treat add additional medicine after you change water, if you take out 50% of the water, you also take out 50% of any medicine you add.

If you filter has carbon in it, you must remove the carbon as this will take most of the medicine out of the water - to be honest, unless you actually need to remove a chemical of somesort from the tank - carbon is more of a money making scheme to the shops than it is of benefit in a freshwater tank (same for nitrate removing media - why use it when the same thing can be doine simply by changing some water for a lot less money Wink).

Most important, keep calm on all this and dont feel bad, lots of people have made this mistake, its more often than not the fault of the fish shops (we call them LFS here = Local Fish Shop) - who generally are in it for the money, the more fish you kill, the better it is for their wallets - not all shops are like this, but some are.

So right now (tonight if you read this in time) change 50% of the water and do the same inthe morning - sometime tomorrow, get the medication needed for whatever is wrong with the fish - good lcuk and im sure all will work itself out soon

Doint hesitate to ask anything - were here to help and happy to do so Wink
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Rich
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PostSubject: Re: Pregnant Platty   Sat Apr 18, 2009 9:54 am

I forgot to ask - what size is your tank (in liters please) or at least the make and model number if you know - likewise the filter (or I assume it came with a filter etc)

Something else to help the fish is if you have an air pump with your tank, have it set to create as much disturbance as possible (the more bubbles the better) as this will help the fish breathe better (more to it than that but we wont bore you with detail - its not necessary and the end result is the same Wink)

If not - or as well as the above, if you can, have the outlet water from the fliter(s) create as much disturbance to the water surface as possible.

I also suggest not feeding the fish for a day or two - frankly, they wont feel like feeding as much, and if nothing goes in, nothing comes out the other end (so to speak Very Happy) and you wont have uneaten food causing more problems if you dont put any in - when you do next feed them (say sunday) they may well be more hungry and eat what you give them (only give a small amount and see if they eat it - if so, let them finish and add a little more until they look bored and then stop, and dont feed again until tuesday)

I think ive covered everything, if not im sure someone will fill in the blanks.

If it makes you feel better, ive been keeping fish for two years now, so im no expert but id say more than average knowledgeable (as too are most our members - weve all learned what we know the hard way Wink), I recently started a new tank, anbd lost most of my fish - it turned out to be 'aquarium safe' decor that poisoned my tank - the symptoms were much like an uncycled tank - the cure is/was the same, frequent water changes blah blah.

The only difference was that I used carbon to remove the pollutant chemical(s) - some people will ssay carbon can deal with ammonia and nitrite, others will say not, yet more say the carbon simply clogs up faster with these chemicals present and then re-releases them once the active sites of the carbon are full - anyway, my experience is that carbon makes no difference to ammonia and nitrite levels and is too expensive to be wasted in this manner - keep it for emergencies (a good example is if someone uses an air freshener in the same room as the tank or like me you find yourself with not so fish safe items in the water)

Hope this help Wink


Last edited by Rich on Sat Apr 18, 2009 10:59 am; edited 1 time in total
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PostSubject: Re: Pregnant Platty   Sat Apr 18, 2009 10:20 am

Unless you provide a source of ammonia for the filter bacteria to establish, then the water will not be suitable for the fish. Ideally, this is done via the Fishless Cycling method using a bottle of ammonia but, more traditionally by using a few so-called "hardy fish" but not one to be recommended nowadays.

More than likely, your fish succumbed to the toxic effects of ammonia and/or nitrite as the filter bacteria hadn't been established to process the fish waste. I suggest you get an API Master Test Kit to check the ammonia, nitrite and nitrate levels. If the first two register any reading, you'll need to do daily water changes of at least 50% until both are zero again.

Please do not add any more fish until the tank is fully cycled (i.e. both ammonia and nitrite are zero and nitrate is as low as possible). After that, you will only be able to add 1-2 fish per week, doing a water change beforehand. This is to allow the filter bacteria time to adjust to the new bioload and multiply accordingly. If you add too many fish at once, then they will probably just die due to elevated ammonia and/or nitrite levels.

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PostSubject: Re: Pregnant Platty   Sat Apr 18, 2009 10:44 am

trust me/us - you have more than enough ammonia in the tank as it is - DO NOT ADD AMMONIA

the usual source of ammonia as I said is in the waste your fish produce, even by not feeding them as often, they will still produce enough ammonia for the bacteria (yes fish do drink and thus excrete urine - even the most experienced of us have never seen a fish drink or pee Very Happy)

Anyway, the shopping list includes an

API Freshwater Master test Kit

Melafix and Pimafix
(always useful to have around anyway) one of these is anti bacterial and the other antifungal - usually, when fish sustain a wound, they get 1st a bacterial infection and often a secondary fungal infection, many of us here when using melafix, use pimafix at the same time Wink

White Spot treatment
again useful to have to hand

Finrot Treament
, (Melafix and pimafix usually fix finrot tbh)

Water Dechlorinator
(lots of it _ I personally use king british safe guard but there are many to choose from, some work out more economical than others, so in the long run, it pays to shop around and do the maths of amount of water treated per )

Filter Starter Treatment
- This is subjective, some people scream snake oil (ie waste of money and time) others swear by them, I personally have had success and failure with various brands - the ones that have worked for me are King British Safe Water and Bactinettes. In your current situation, I would suggest trying anything - at worst it wont make a difference and at best, it will make life easier on your remaining fish.

We never said keeping fish was cheap Wink - actuallym, the startup like in many hobbies is the most expensive part, trust me, in a few months time when you have a happy healthy community of fish, youll be glad of the work etc.

Whilst in the fish shop, I suggest you ask (in as firm a manner as possible) for a decent amount of their filter media that they have running in their filters (ie not new) - you want slime covered dirty brown icky yucky (you get the idea) old filter media from well established systems. This will greatly kick start (imagine a rocket boosted car from a starting line) the whole cycle for you and will hopefully mean a much faster recovery of your tank, but even if your lucky and the LFS supplies the media (remember to be persistant and even offer to pay for it) continue the water changes and to treat the sick fish.

If all else fails and the shop refuses, drop me a private message with your postal address and I'll send you some filter media in the post (next day delivery) - or if you post where you live (or the nearest major city/twon to you) one of our members may be close enough to drop some over to you or you collect in person.
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PostSubject: Re: Pregnant Platty   Sat Apr 18, 2009 8:03 pm

new fish owner wrote:
we're new to having fish and started off 2 weeks ago with 14 fish


3 Clown loaches
2 Pleck
5 Cardinal Tetra
4 Platty

we now only have 4 platty's!!!! one of which is pregnant. one of the males is constantly by her nursery net and is chasing the other males away from her and he appears to have like a white shimmer on him at the moment and we are wondering if he could possibly be the "daddy" so to speak and is looking after her? and are wondering if the white shimmer he appears to have is due to stress?

any help/advice would be greatly appreciated.

thanks

It's a shame when this happens nfo - but believe me, unfortunately you are not the first person this has happened to, and I hope it wont put you off fishkeeping, which can actually be a lot of fun!

Mary and Rich have given you a lot of information in the posts above, all stuff worth reading to help you understand what is happening with your fish at the moment, but maybe a bit mind boggling at first.

Take your time to read through it when you can and ask as many questions as you need. Another useful thing to read is this --

http://tropicalfishfanatics.forumsmotion.com/cycling-and-water-chemistry-f70/cycling-with-fish-t360.htm.

Hope you like reading!!!Smile

For now though the main thing you need to do is -

Test your tank water. If you get readings other than Ammonia 0, Nitrite 0 and Nitrate less then 40, then do an immediate water change with dechlorinated water. You might have to do this more than once a day.

As for your plattys - do you know how many males/females you have?

I hope all this wont put you off, it is all sortable, and you will end up with a tank full of happy fish - it just takes a bit of time and patience Smile

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6 Harlequin Rasboras, 5 Emerald Eye Rasboras, 10 Cherry Barbs, 2 Bristlenose Plecs, 2 Panda Corys. 4 Dwarf Chain Loaches.

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1 red male betta, 1 BN
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PostSubject: Re: Pregnant Platty   Sat Apr 18, 2009 9:18 pm

I also forgot to say that most shops offer a water testing service, some dont do this at all, a few charge for it but most do it for free - take a pen n paper and jot down the results if you have a shop test it - but do not allow them to bully you into buying priducts that alter your pH as they are false economy (until you become more experienced) its better to buy fish that suit the pH of your water as it comes from the tap than to alter the water to suit them Wink

Your pH will bounce about all over the place whilst your tank cycles - its perfectly normal and unless you just want to practice pH testing for yourslef, its not worth bothering with for now - likewise, your nitrate isnt critical atm so again, save te test solution foir when you need it and only monitor Ammonia and Nitrite.

Just a woird of note - most of those fish you lost were actually fine for the average community tank - however, the common plec (and im assuming thats what you were sold) grow to huge sizes -and require a tank of at least 300liters in the long term, clown loaches also grow big, not to the same sort of scale, but they are very active fish and require alot of swimming space as well as being happiest in larger groups -

We see this all the time here, shoips that dont give adequate advice about fish sizes etc and you the hobbyist ends up with a problem later on - this will sound awful but in some respects, the death of these fish now has saved you heartache later on.

When your water is up n running as it should (it wont take long, we promise) come back and we'll talk about suitable fish - actually, the best thing to do whilst waiting is to research what fish you like the look of, make a short list of those you really like the look of and then ask us which are or are not suitable candidates Wink

We will need to know what sized tank you have and the pH of the water from your tap - the way to test this is to fill a cup or jar with tap water, and leave it for 24hours to allow the chlorine to dissipate (hint at the way to save 's buy dechlorinating water for free there Very Happy - my water is full of other heavy metals so I have to use dechlorinator whatever anyway) then test the pH - another test to either buy or have done is for the water hardness - measured in degrees Hardness, both general hardness (dGh) and degrees of carbonate hardness (dKh) - not all fish like the same sort of water and this is useful information to know if you plan on keeping real plants as well

As you can tell, there is more to keeping fish than many realise - but its fascinating to learn about and not as complicated as it may seem Wink the usual maintainenece is just feeding, changing water every so often and occasional filter maintainenece - the hard part is walking past a fish shop without going in - or harder still, going iun and leaving with only the food you intended to get without bags of water and other fish Very Happy

Later on, you may want to come to us for councilling on MTS or BTS or worse MBTS (More tanks sybdrome - the habit of buying more fish tanks) BTS is buying bigger tanks so you can have more and or bigger fish) or even worse,buying more bigger tanks

All these are very infectious and the only known cure requires a credit card and or understaninding bank manager Very Happy

We all have these diseases, its useless to resist the power of the dark side (oh, that reminds me, when you start drooling over marine fish, then you really have problems Very Happy)

fish fish fish fish fish fish fish fish fish fish
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Pregnant Platty
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